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Post by Deleted on Dec 16, 2020 12:09:46 GMT
I just think by favouring someone we treat them as inferior. So giving someone a job because they are black we are ignoring their talent. Of course the opposite is racism. Every person that has skin in the game (to coin an American phrase? that I have spoken to just wants a level playing field so that it's only talent and work ethic that counts. The trouble is that is not always the case. It starts in childhood, with poor education, poor housing, financial pressure on the parents. Which then becomes a vicious circle, which it has
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Post by Gassy on Dec 16, 2020 12:19:19 GMT
I just think by favouring someone we treat them as inferior. So giving someone a job because they are black we are ignoring their talent. Of course the opposite is racism. Every person that has skin in the game (to coin an American phrase? that I have spoken to just wants a level playing field so that it's only talent and work ethic that counts. The trouble is that is not always the case. It starts in childhood, with poor education, poor housing, financial pressure on the parents. Which then becomes a vicious circle, which it has I know you didn't bring it up Oldie, but can we not do the whole race thing yet again? Plenty of threads in this section for that already
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Post by Deleted on Dec 16, 2020 12:28:34 GMT
Every person that has skin in the game (to coin an American phrase? that I have spoken to just wants a level playing field so that it's only talent and work ethic that counts. The trouble is that is not always the case. It starts in childhood, with poor education, poor housing, financial pressure on the parents. Which then becomes a vicious circle, which it has I know you didn't bring it up Oldie, but can we not do the whole race thing yet again? Plenty of threads in this section for that already No, absolutely. But it occured to me that with all the evidence, and growing, of the demographic breakdown of Covid infection, all the reports on health inequality and the J Rowntree report on destitution in the UK that there is triangulation. Probably a bit early and it's poverty not race, race just being a subset.
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Post by inee on Dec 16, 2020 12:46:25 GMT
I’m not a member but yes I’m pro European and against Brexit . There was a reason why I blocked you on Twitter because I don’t want to engage with sad little racists like yourself . Ha ha there you go again.....different opinions and views = racist.....when will you lefties ever learn? Funny that you would have been happy to see a proven anti Semitic party take charge of the country, but guess racism doesn’t count when it relates to Jewish people! so i spose christians, catholics,muslims,jw's and many more are not religions they are a race, why do people find it so difficult to understand rligion and race are two seperate things
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pirate
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Post by pirate on Dec 16, 2020 14:15:47 GMT
They have a difference of opinion. That happens. Again, no evidence is provided to refute Professor Bhakdi. You don't need to be an economist to have an opinion on the economic effects of a lockdown. Its fairly obvious and we are now seeing that 618,000 job losses and official forecasts predicting "the biggest economic decline in 300 years." But you seem too hold this University of such high stature, but now it goes against your rhetoric - it's a difference of opinion? Ok let's look at it from a different direction, the quote you pulled from Bhakdi, can you please show me where you pulled it from? We'll see if he's giving scientific reasoning for the University of Mainz to shoot down. Because as far as I see it, where is Bhakdi's scientific evidence that a lockdown is "grotesque, absurd and very dangerous"? There is literature everywhere of how a lock down prevents a disease from spreading. Are you really questioning that? You're quoting a retired Covid conspiracy theorist who has shown no scientific evidence of his claims and presenting them as fact. You did the same with your other scientist a few weeks ago in the Pfizer thread too. Yes a lockdown will have economic effects, no one is saying it wouldn't. It's about finding a balance, your "scientists" that you're quoting aren't suggesting finding something in the middle, they're suggesting Covid is a hoax, the numbers aren't real, the vaccine won't make a difference and Covid is no worse than the flu. Where is the scientific evidence to back up any of those claims? I asked earlier in the thread what would happen if we lost 1% of the British population in a year. Well funnily enough, that would be roughly the amount of job losses we've seen. Would it be better for people to lose jobs and be put on furlough, or die? What about next year? And the year after? We've caused 618,000 job losses, 30,000 excess non Covid home deaths and the "biggest economic decline in 300 years" for something that has an average death age of 80 and mostly only seriously affects people with underlying health conditions. All based on the modelling predictions of Professor doom Neil Ferguson who's previous predictions for Foot and Mouth Disease were described as “not fit for purpose” and “seriously flawed” by Professor Michael Thrusfield of Edinburgh University. The Coding that led to the lockdown was "totally unreliable" and a "buggy mess" that would "get you fired in private industry" say data experts.
"Across 51 locations, the median COVID-19 infection fatality rate was 0.27% (corrected 0.23%). ... In people < 70 years, infection fatality rates ranged from 0.00% to 0.31% with crude and corrected medians of 0.05%.
www.who.int/bulletin/online_first/BLT.20.265892.pdf
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Post by Deleted on Dec 16, 2020 15:35:52 GMT
Omg. What was your previuos user name on here? Dearthofknowledge A ghost from Christmas past maybe
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Post by Deleted on Dec 16, 2020 15:45:06 GMT
But you seem too hold this University of such high stature, but now it goes against your rhetoric - it's a difference of opinion? Ok let's look at it from a different direction, the quote you pulled from Bhakdi, can you please show me where you pulled it from? We'll see if he's giving scientific reasoning for the University of Mainz to shoot down. Because as far as I see it, where is Bhakdi's scientific evidence that a lockdown is "grotesque, absurd and very dangerous"? There is literature everywhere of how a lock down prevents a disease from spreading. Are you really questioning that? You're quoting a retired Covid conspiracy theorist who has shown no scientific evidence of his claims and presenting them as fact. You did the same with your other scientist a few weeks ago in the Pfizer thread too. Yes a lockdown will have economic effects, no one is saying it wouldn't. It's about finding a balance, your "scientists" that you're quoting aren't suggesting finding something in the middle, they're suggesting Covid is a hoax, the numbers aren't real, the vaccine won't make a difference and Covid is no worse than the flu. Where is the scientific evidence to back up any of those claims? I asked earlier in the thread what would happen if we lost 1% of the British population in a year. Well funnily enough, that would be roughly the amount of job losses we've seen. Would it be better for people to lose jobs and be put on furlough, or die? What about next year? And the year after? We've caused 618,000 job losses, 30,000 excess non Covid home deaths and the "biggest economic decline in 300 years" for something that has an average death age of 80 and mostly only seriously affects people with underlying health conditions. All based on the modelling predictions of Professor doom Neil Ferguson who's previous predictions for Foot and Mouth Disease were described as “not fit for purpose” and “seriously flawed” by Professor Michael Thrusfield of Edinburgh University. The Coding that led to the lockdown was "totally unreliable" and a "buggy mess" that would "get you fired in private industry" say data experts.
"Across 51 locations, the median COVID-19 infection fatality rate was 0.27% (corrected 0.23%). ... In people < 70 years, infection fatality rates ranged from 0.00% to 0.31% with crude and corrected medians of 0.05%.
www.who.int/bulletin/online_first/BLT.20.265892.pdf
Let's forget this or that theoretical model for predicting the outcome. Let's ask the NHS. Are you becoming overloaded and how do we stop that? Englebert Humperdinck from Germany can sit down and shut the f**k up.
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pirate
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Post by pirate on Dec 16, 2020 16:57:19 GMT
We've caused 618,000 job losses, 30,000 excess non Covid home deaths and the "biggest economic decline in 300 years" for something that has an average death age of 80 and mostly only seriously affects people with underlying health conditions. All based on the modelling predictions of Professor doom Neil Ferguson who's previous predictions for Foot and Mouth Disease were described as “not fit for purpose” and “seriously flawed” by Professor Michael Thrusfield of Edinburgh University. The Coding that led to the lockdown was "totally unreliable" and a "buggy mess" that would "get you fired in private industry" say data experts.
"Across 51 locations, the median COVID-19 infection fatality rate was 0.27% (corrected 0.23%). ... In people < 70 years, infection fatality rates ranged from 0.00% to 0.31% with crude and corrected medians of 0.05%.
www.who.int/bulletin/online_first/BLT.20.265892.pdf
Let's forget this or that theoretical model for predicting the outcome. Let's ask the NHS. Are you becoming overloaded and how do we stop that? Englebert Humperdinck from Germany can sit down and shut the f**k up. Only four trusts in all of England were busier on average during the week ending November 22 than they were last December and most of the country's Nightingale hospitals have never treated a single patient. Dr Karol Sikora, of the University of Buckingham, accused the government of running a "brainwashing PR campaign" and using "data which doesn't stack up." "We've gone back to how it started in March, with [the Government] claiming we need the measures to protect the NHS. The data you've shown me proves that it doesn't need protecting. It's dealing with Covid very well indeed." "What the data shows is that hospitals are not working at full capacity and they've still got some spare beds for Covid if necessary. The public is being misled, the data doesn't stack up. Fear and scaremongering is being used to keep people out of hospital."
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Post by Officer Barbrady on Dec 16, 2020 17:02:59 GMT
We've caused 618,000 job losses, 30,000 excess non Covid home deaths and the "biggest economic decline in 300 years" for something that has an average death age of 80 and mostly only seriously affects people with underlying health conditions. All based on the modelling predictions of Professor doom Neil Ferguson who's previous predictions for Foot and Mouth Disease were described as “not fit for purpose” and “seriously flawed” by Professor Michael Thrusfield of Edinburgh University. The Coding that led to the lockdown was "totally unreliable" and a "buggy mess" that would "get you fired in private industry" say data experts.
"Across 51 locations, the median COVID-19 infection fatality rate was 0.27% (corrected 0.23%). ... In people < 70 years, infection fatality rates ranged from 0.00% to 0.31% with crude and corrected medians of 0.05%.
www.who.int/bulletin/online_first/BLT.20.265892.pdf
Let's forget this or that theoretical model for predicting the outcome. Let's ask the NHS. Are you becoming overloaded and how do we stop that? Englebert Humperdinck from Germany can sit down and shut the f**k up. Hiya. Yeah its pretty bad. Be great if y'all could try not to get it and spread it too much if that's OK? Won't be too long now. Oh, and thanks to those of you going elsewhere for your care and staying out of acute services during this period. The volume reduction is noted and you have our gratitude for that. Dont let it stop you seeking care if you need it though. But hey, just because beds on ward C are looking ok doesn't mean Resus and ICU isn't full. So you know, try to stay well and all that.
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pirate
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Post by pirate on Dec 16, 2020 17:12:27 GMT
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Post by Officer Barbrady on Dec 16, 2020 17:22:54 GMT
And? You want to push it to 100% or what? 60,000 candidates for getting critically ill are already dead you remember? Oh, any chance of one of those graphs that is you know, not 6 weeks out of date?
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Post by inee on Dec 16, 2020 17:34:10 GMT
Let's forget this or that theoretical model for predicting the outcome. Let's ask the NHS. Are you becoming overloaded and how do we stop that? Englebert Humperdinck from Germany can sit down and shut the f**k up. Only four trusts in all of England were busier on average during the week ending November 22 than they were last December and most of the country's Nightingale hospitals have never treated a single patient. Dr Karol Sikora, of the University of Buckingham, accused the government of running a "brainwashing PR campaign" and using "data which doesn't stack up." "We've gone back to how it started in March, with [the Government] claiming we need the measures to protect the NHS. The data you've shown me proves that it doesn't need protecting. It's dealing with Covid very well indeed." "What the data shows is that hospitals are not working at full capacity and they've still got some spare beds for Covid if necessary. The public is being misled, the data doesn't stack up. Fear and scaremongering is being used to keep people out of hospital." Pirate not having a dig but have you read this and the virus thread, as there several posters who have lost relatives to corona and a few are currently suffering from it. That's better proof than a few web pages
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Post by trevorgas on Dec 16, 2020 17:38:17 GMT
Let's forget this or that theoretical model for predicting the outcome. Let's ask the NHS. Are you becoming overloaded and how do we stop that? Englebert Humperdinck from Germany can sit down and shut the f**k up. Only four trusts in all of England were busier on average during the week ending November 22 than they were last December and most of the country's Nightingale hospitals have never treated a single patient. Dr Karol Sikora, of the University of Buckingham, accused the government of running a "brainwashing PR campaign" and using "data which doesn't stack up." "We've gone back to how it started in March, with [the Government] claiming we need the measures to protect the NHS. The data you've shown me proves that it doesn't need protecting. It's dealing with Covid very well indeed." "What the data shows is that hospitals are not working at full capacity and they've still got some spare beds for Covid if necessary. The public is being misled, the data doesn't stack up. Fear and scaremongering is being used to keep people out of hospital." Please articulate why any government would want to do this,what the capacity is today is irrelevant every year for the past decade the NHS has been close to full during Dec/Jan/Feb so don't you think that if you overlay Covid it will be a hell of a lot worse. I don't get wtf your trying to prove .
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Post by inee on Dec 16, 2020 17:46:29 GMT
Quick question on that data, are the same amount of beds used in the 2015 sample and the 2020 sample, correct me if I'm wrong but i suspect not all corona sufferers will be in an icu bed, that will have a massive impact on figures as will people not being admitted into hospital as they have to recover at home. I feel the reason people don't believe the virus is real is for the simple fact, that the media are no longer reporting on it 24/7 like they did when the first lockdown was announced. I know some who thought it was a hoax to now believe it as a fried of theirs got it. However i believe this virus was man made and got out into the public but reacted very differently to what it was supposed to, before you dismiss the ideal remember several countries have had chemical weapons accidently realeased some intentionally released.
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Post by althepirate on Dec 16, 2020 17:47:50 GMT
I get the feeling we are racists if we don't favour black people. Sorry I think of everyone as equal, if that makes me a racist that's great. Yeah you might think of every one as equal or just simply not discriminate, which is great and good on you Al. Unfortunately there is an element of society that doesn't like anyone different to them, and actively discriminate. Are you saying you have never heard anyone say anything derogatory against another just because of their race? No I'm not saying that I'm saying to curb racism it has to be fair or it won't be taken up. Abuse should be stopped for everyone not just a favoured group. There is plenty of abuse against white people even on this forum which would be called out if it was against black people. I don't think racism will be stopped until behaviour is fair.
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Post by althepirate on Dec 16, 2020 17:50:27 GMT
Pirate why does your pc just throw up negative anti government results is it something to do with your default settings? I always thought there were two sides to every argument.
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pirate
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Post by pirate on Dec 16, 2020 17:51:04 GMT
Only four trusts in all of England were busier on average during the week ending November 22 than they were last December and most of the country's Nightingale hospitals have never treated a single patient. Dr Karol Sikora, of the University of Buckingham, accused the government of running a "brainwashing PR campaign" and using "data which doesn't stack up." "We've gone back to how it started in March, with [the Government] claiming we need the measures to protect the NHS. The data you've shown me proves that it doesn't need protecting. It's dealing with Covid very well indeed." "What the data shows is that hospitals are not working at full capacity and they've still got some spare beds for Covid if necessary. The public is being misled, the data doesn't stack up. Fear and scaremongering is being used to keep people out of hospital." Pirate not having a dig but have you read this and the virus thread, as there several posters who have lost relatives to corona and a few are currently suffering from it. That's better proof than a few web pages I have also lost a close relative and my heart goes out to everyone that is in that situation too, but that doesn't alter my view that the disproportionate lockdowns have done more harm than good.
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pirate
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Post by pirate on Dec 16, 2020 17:57:02 GMT
Only four trusts in all of England were busier on average during the week ending November 22 than they were last December and most of the country's Nightingale hospitals have never treated a single patient. Dr Karol Sikora, of the University of Buckingham, accused the government of running a "brainwashing PR campaign" and using "data which doesn't stack up." "We've gone back to how it started in March, with [the Government] claiming we need the measures to protect the NHS. The data you've shown me proves that it doesn't need protecting. It's dealing with Covid very well indeed." "What the data shows is that hospitals are not working at full capacity and they've still got some spare beds for Covid if necessary. The public is being misled, the data doesn't stack up. Fear and scaremongering is being used to keep people out of hospital." Please articulate why any government would want to do this,what the capacity is today is irrelevant every year for the past decade the NHS has been close to full during Dec/Jan/Feb so don't you think that if you overlay Covid it will be a hell of a lot worse. I don't get wtf your trying to prove . No evidence the NHS wouldn't be able to cope. Isolate people with symptoms and protect the vulnerable and at risk groups. The NHS certainly won't be helped by "the biggest economic decline in 300 years."
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Post by trevorgas on Dec 16, 2020 18:06:44 GMT
Please articulate why any government would want to do this,what the capacity is today is irrelevant every year for the past decade the NHS has been close to full during Dec/Jan/Feb so don't you think that if you overlay Covid it will be a hell of a lot worse. I don't get wtf your trying to prove . No evidence the NHS wouldn't be able to cope. Isolate people with symptoms and protect the vulnerable and at risk groups. The NHS certainly won't be helped by "the biggest economic decline in 300 years." Sorry but that's just bollocks
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Post by tinner on Dec 16, 2020 18:07:02 GMT
Ha ha there you go again.....different opinions and views = racist.....when will you lefties ever learn? Funny that you would have been happy to see a proven anti Semitic party take charge of the country, but guess racism doesn’t count when it relates to Jewish people! I just call it as I see it ..... I’ve read plenty of your anti Muslim crap , your victimisation of the grenfell fire , your wrongful claims that Muslims were more likely to be involved in rape gangs and your claim that the silent majority were behind the Milwall booing . You won’t find any anti semantic posting from me anywhere. I’ve called it out on here and other places. You can twist stuff to suit your agenda all you like......but the one thing you can't change and I notice you conveniently overlooked it is that you actively supported putting a proven racist party into power at the last election.......so rage all you like but when it boils down to it you and many of your leftie cohort are the biggest culprits going and you try and deflect this by attacking others!!
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