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Post by returnofthedust on Jan 25, 2024 23:19:12 GMT
Mods we are going into that dangerous zone, it’s BARTON ALERT for you, just being a good bloke and tipping you off. (Hope Gasdust has gone to bed!) Lock the thread and throw it into general chat quickly! |
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Post by gashead1981 on Jan 25, 2024 23:19:31 GMT
My ban button is at the ready as long as you pair of pricks don't cut bait and leave first.... 😉😉😉
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pirate
Forum Legend
Posts: 19,461 
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Post by pirate on Jan 26, 2024 1:56:28 GMT
What structure have historically similar sized clubs or ones that have had recent success operated with at this level or below?
In League One at the time, Brentford hired two Directors of Football, a Head of Recruitment, Chief Scout, scouting network and had access to bespoke data from the owners gambling company. They focused on recruitment and players under 23 with a re-sale value, because as one of the DoF's said at the time: "Recruitment is the bread and butter of Brentford because we have one of the lowest revenues in the league. We need to make the business sustainable by buying cheap and selling expensive."
Luton in League One had an excellent CEO in Gary Sweet, an experienced football man in Chief Recruitment Officer Mick Harford and a Head of Scouting Operations in Geoff Chapple.
Peterborough have a CEO, Head of Football Operations, a Director of Football in Barry Fry and a Chief scout in Sam Gaughran and vast scouting network beyond that.
Stockport and Wrexham are first and second in the division below. Stockport have a good CEO, plus the former City Football Group employee Simon Wilson as Director of Football and the former Prem and England player Matt Janson as Chief Scout. Wrexham have the experienced CEO's Shaun Harvey and Fleur Robinson, a chief scout in Chris Johnson and the former Football Association technical director Les Reed advising the board.
We are like the Dog & Duck FC in comparison.
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Post by Feeling The Blues on Jan 26, 2024 8:50:00 GMT
What structure have historically similar sized clubs or ones that have had recent success operated with at this level or below? In League One at the time, Brentford hired two Directors of Football, a Head of Recruitment, Chief Scout, scouting network and had access to bespoke data from the owners gambling company. They focused on recruitment and players under 23 with a re-sale value, because as one of the DoF's said at the time: "Recruitment is the bread and butter of Brentford because we have one of the lowest revenues in the league. We need to make the business sustainable by buying cheap and selling expensive." Luton in League One had an excellent CEO in Gary Sweet, an experienced football man in Chief Recruitment Officer Mick Harford and a Head of Scouting Operations in Geoff Chapple. Peterborough have a CEO, Head of Football Operations, a Director of Football in Barry Fry and a Chief scout in Sam Gaughran and vast scouting network beyond that. Stockport and Wrexham are first and second in the division below. Stockport have a good CEO, plus the former City Football Group employee Simon Wilson as Director of Football and the former Prem and England player Matt Janson as Chief Scout. Wrexham have the experienced CEO's Shaun Harvey and Fleur Robinson, a chief scout in Chris Johnson and the former Football Association technical director Les Reed advising the board. We are like the Dog & Duck FC in comparison. All of those clubs have a smaller support base than we do, No doubt Wrexham and Stockport will be leaving us in their wake soon too. All of our owners ever, have failed to deliver anything better than 3rd division mediocrity and ramshackle facilities for the fans. The current owner also seems to be running the club like a corner shop, has zero understanding of how a successful club should be run, wants to cut costs even further and communicate even less with the fans than any of his predecessors. Why is he here? |
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Post by poorblue on Jan 26, 2024 9:03:10 GMT
Cheap journalism simply reading fans forums. Simply needs to open his pc for stories. Each sports reporter for each EFL club just cut and paste forum panic stories word for word to each other. |
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Post by Feeling The Blues on Jan 26, 2024 9:15:25 GMT
Cheap journalism simply reading fans forums. Simply needs to open his pc for stories. Each sports reporter for each EFL club just cut and paste forum panic stories word for word to each other. Nonsense. I’ve said why I think that earlier in this thread so no point double posting. What is a concern though is that we have fans who instead of questioning or calling out bad things that go on at the FC that are to the detriment of the FC they prefer to stick their fingers in their ears and try to discredit the messenger! Why would anyone do that? The owner and the FC are completely separate things! |
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pirate
Forum Legend
Posts: 19,461
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Post by pirate on Jan 26, 2024 9:21:56 GMT
What structure have historically similar sized clubs or ones that have had recent success operated with at this level or below? In League One at the time, Brentford hired two Directors of Football, a Head of Recruitment, Chief Scout, scouting network and had access to bespoke data from the owners gambling company. They focused on recruitment and players under 23 with a re-sale value, because as one of the DoF's said at the time: "Recruitment is the bread and butter of Brentford because we have one of the lowest revenues in the league. We need to make the business sustainable by buying cheap and selling expensive." Luton in League One had an excellent CEO in Gary Sweet, an experienced football man in Chief Recruitment Officer Mick Harford and a Head of Scouting Operations in Geoff Chapple. Peterborough have a CEO, Head of Football Operations, a Director of Football in Barry Fry and a Chief scout in Sam Gaughran and vast scouting network beyond that. Stockport and Wrexham are first and second in the division below. Stockport have a good CEO, plus the former City Football Group employee Simon Wilson as Director of Football and the former Prem and England player Matt Janson as Chief Scout. Wrexham have the experienced CEO's Shaun Harvey and Fleur Robinson, a chief scout in Chris Johnson and the former Football Association technical director Les Reed advising the board. We are like the Dog & Duck FC in comparison. All of those clubs have a smaller support base than we do, No doubt Wrexham and Stockport will be leaving us in their wake soon too. All of our owners ever, have failed to deliver anything better than 3rd division mediocrity and ramshackle facilities for the fans. The current owner also seems to be running the club like a corner shop, has zero understanding of how a successful club should be run, wants to cut costs even further and communicate even less with the fans than any of his predecessors. Why is he here? You can even look at a club like Oxford United. Their CEO Tim Williams is ex Inter Milan and Man Utd. They have a Head of Recruitment in ex Bordeaux Ed Waldron, vastly experience Derek Fazakerley as a scout, plus David Horseman scouting and also in the summer they appointed Dave Bowman, the former Chief Scout of Cardiff, Millwall, Sunderland, and Wolves. Bowman has over 30 years experience in the scouting world and also scouted internationally for the Republic of Ireland and had experience of a Sporting Director role at Ipswich. Oxford buy and sell well for vast fees, while also maintaining a competitive squad. We haven't reached the League One playoffs in over 25 years, which is disgraceful. |
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Post by chewbacca on Jan 26, 2024 9:50:12 GMT
All of those clubs have a smaller support base than we do, No doubt Wrexham and Stockport will be leaving us in their wake soon too. All of our owners ever, have failed to deliver anything better than 3rd division mediocrity and ramshackle facilities for the fans. The current owner also seems to be running the club like a corner shop, has zero understanding of how a successful club should be run, wants to cut costs even further and communicate even less with the fans than any of his predecessors. Why is he here? You can even look at a club like Oxford United. Their CEO Tim Williams is ex Inter Milan and Man Utd. They have a Head of Recruitment in ex Bordeaux Ed Waldron, vastly experience Derek Fazakerley as a scout, plus David Horseman scouting and also in the summer they appointed Dave Bowman, the former Chief Scout of Cardiff, Millwall, Sunderland, and Wolves. Bowman has over 30 years experience in the scouting world and also scouted internationally for the Republic of Ireland and had experience of a Sporting Director role at Ipswich. Oxford buy and sell well for vast fees, while also maintaining a competitive squad. We haven't reached the League One playoffs in over 25 years, which is disgraceful. 27 Years you Rose Tinter. Seriously though, I agree to an extent about experience but we could also find people on their way up. What's really needed is someone with experience to head up the football side of the club. |
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Post by gashead1981 on Jan 26, 2024 14:14:16 GMT
All of those clubs have a smaller support base than we do, No doubt Wrexham and Stockport will be leaving us in their wake soon too. All of our owners ever, have failed to deliver anything better than 3rd division mediocrity and ramshackle facilities for the fans. The current owner also seems to be running the club like a corner shop, has zero understanding of how a successful club should be run, wants to cut costs even further and communicate even less with the fans than any of his predecessors. Why is he here? You can even look at a club like Oxford United. Their CEO Tim Williams is ex Inter Milan and Man Utd. They have a Head of Recruitment in ex Bordeaux Ed Waldron, vastly experience Derek Fazakerley as a scout, plus David Horseman scouting and also in the summer they appointed Dave Bowman, the former Chief Scout of Cardiff, Millwall, Sunderland, and Wolves. Bowman has over 30 years experience in the scouting world and also scouted internationally for the Republic of Ireland and had experience of a Sporting Director role at Ipswich. Oxford buy and sell well for vast fees, while also maintaining a competitive squad. We haven't reached the League One playoffs in over 25 years, which is disgraceful. Oxford have a structure, always have an excellent playing budget, sign some very good players and they also have their stadium plans in place. It's a shame they didnt see that Robinson didnt have the managerial nouse to get them into the championship really and kept him on a year too long. |
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Post by badengas on Jan 26, 2024 16:48:14 GMT
Shambolic owners.
Building new stands, buying players, what will they think of next ?
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Post by gashead1981 on Jan 26, 2024 18:25:26 GMT
Shambolic owners. Building new stands, buying players, what will they think of next ? You are missing the point entirely and it's that kind of thinking as to why we will never get into the championship and lose £4m pa hoping that our rich benefactors don't get bored. This isn't me being a doom and gloom merchant. It's about being properly run so we can attract the best talent both on and off the field and push us forward. |
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Post by Topper Gas on Jan 26, 2024 18:39:32 GMT
Shambolic owners. Building new stands, buying players, what will they think of next ? You are missing the point entirely and it's that kind of thinking as to why we will never get into the championship and lose £4m pa hoping that our rich benefactors don't get bored. This isn't me being a doom and gloom merchant. It's about being properly run so we can attract the best talent both on and off the field and push us forward. When were we last run "properly", why's it suddenly such a big issue now but you weren't concerned about how the club was run under Wael when the likes of SwissGas were raising their concerns about how he was running the club, and you even went as far as joining the other forum to challenge his views? There's something odd about two of Wael's biggest supporters now suddenly showing concern about the way the club's being run when it's been a bit of a basket case for years, if not decades. |
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Post by popuppirate on Jan 26, 2024 18:51:03 GMT
Shambolic owners. Building new stands, buying players, what will they think of next ? You are missing the point entirely and it's that kind of thinking as to why we will never get into the championship and lose £4m pa hoping that our rich benefactors don't get bored. This isn't me being a doom and gloom merchant. It's about being properly run so we can attract the best talent both on and off the field and push us forward. I think it was a perfectly reasonable comment, on a thread with such a title and with another thread of a similar vein titled rather disrespectfully. It's not the fans fault we haven't reached the championship. There's nothing wrong with demanding better, but the utter meltdown on here the last few days which appears to stem from a handful has snowballed to a ridiculous level in which it seems, despite 2 very positive signings, the club/owners have still fouled up somehow in these dealings. I'm sure there's many WhatsApp groups where people share 'info' with 'contacts in the game' but to those not included in those groups, or to many of us, progress in some areas seems to be evident. The gossip group on here that spout 'facts' (and abuse) don't need to tell everyone how we should support our club or to not believe our eyes and official updates. |
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Post by aghast on Jan 26, 2024 22:09:35 GMT
You are missing the point entirely and it's that kind of thinking as to why we will never get into the championship and lose £4m pa hoping that our rich benefactors don't get bored. This isn't me being a doom and gloom merchant. It's about being properly run so we can attract the best talent both on and off the field and push us forward. When were we last run "properly", why's it suddenly such a big issue now but you weren't concerned about how the club was run under Wael when the likes of SwissGas were raising their concerns about how he was running the club, and you even went as far as joining the other forum to challenge his views? There's something odd about two of Wael's biggest supporters now suddenly showing concern about the way the club's being run when it's been a bit of a basket case for years, if not decades. Agreed. It's a mystery and I detect something personal in all this. |
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Post by stapletongas on Jan 26, 2024 22:18:16 GMT
Shambolic owners. Building new stands, buying players, what will they think of next ? Bloody disgrace, whatever next |
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Post by gashead1981 on Jan 26, 2024 22:44:52 GMT
When were we last run "properly", why's it suddenly such a big issue now but you weren't concerned about how the club was run under Wael when the likes of SwissGas were raising their concerns about how he was running the club, and you even went as far as joining the other forum to challenge his views? There's something odd about two of Wael's biggest supporters now suddenly showing concern about the way the club's being run when it's been a bit of a basket case for years, if not decades. Agreed. It's a mystery and I detect something personal in all this. You're starting to sound like the AF. Just look at the evidence and if anyone has half a business head on them, it will show them up so far to be utterly out of their depth. |
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Post by aghast on Jan 26, 2024 23:07:23 GMT
Agreed. It's a mystery and I detect something personal in all this. You're starting to sound like the AF. Just look at the evidence and if anyone has half a business head on them, it will show them up so far to be utterly out of their depth. Maybe. So why was everything so fabulous under Wael, why isn't it now, and what has changed? He could literally do nothing wrong in your eyes and any criticism was jumped on. Yet he appointed Barton, who you and many others turned against, he oversaw the biggest losses we've ever incurred, and he failed to deliver two stadium projects. Yet he was beyond reproach. So why was it so good then, and it's so bad now? It doesn't add up. Something has happened to make you change your views and it's more than just the current, business as usual, ragbag Rovers. |
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Post by devonwhite9 on Jan 26, 2024 23:56:35 GMT
To bring this back to the topic of ownership - it's supporters who are the constant. Generations support the club. People visit graves to tell deceased relatives their club has been promoted or relegated. You're more likely to change your husband or wife than your football club. Managers and players come and go but leave behind memories for the supporters. But we are all indebted to the owners and it's the owners who can make or break the future of a club - no-one else.
Owning a football club is not like owning a supermarket. People won't flock to the Mem from Ashton Gate because we're promoting a 2 for 1 offer on cold pasties. Rovers fans won't flock to the Gate because they're tired of wading through water every time they need to take a leak. They will follow their allegiances through thick or thin. Therefore there's a level of scrutiny and accountability that doesn't come with other businesses.
When you buy a football club, you are a custodian and buying the responsibility that goes with it. We are always grateful when £3m of debt is capitalised as it secures our short term future, but the fact is it's the owner's obligation to make good the debts if they are not running the club in a sustainable way. No owner is forced into buying a club - it's a personal choice and that responsibility comes with it. They know the bottom line when they take it on.
I miss the days when football clubs were owned by local businessmen driving big Jags (or a Porsche in Geoff Dunford's case). You knew you weren't going to blow the world apart but if you unearthed the odd gem the top 6 would be a fair target.
I've got faith in our owners because there's no real reason not to. We've got a new stand which is quite a feat for us and they seem to be backing the manager. But supporters are not customers - we need communication; we need to know what the plan is for the Mem having been categorically told staying there isn't an option; we want to know who's on our staff (a friend of McAllister isn't sure he's even employed by us at all).
At the moment it all feels a bit deja vu from the days when Steve Hamer was claiming the landing lights were on at the UWE to not being able to pay for a fence. We bounce from breaking our transfer record and it falling through to not being able to employ an assistant. Sometimes it's not big promises we need but just a commitment to support the club properly in the position it's in.
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Post by Hugo the Elder on Jan 27, 2024 5:52:42 GMT
You're starting to sound like the AF. Just look at the evidence and if anyone has half a business head on them, it will show them up so far to be utterly out of their depth. Maybe. So why was everything so fabulous under Wael, why isn't it now, and what has changed? He could literally do nothing wrong in your eyes and any criticism was jumped on. Yet he appointed Barton, who you and many others turned against, he oversaw the biggest losses we've ever incurred, and he failed to deliver two stadium projects. Yet he was beyond reproach. So why was it so good then, and it's so bad now? It doesn't add up. Something has happened to make you change your views and it's more than just the current, business as usual, ragbag Rovers. Read 81s post on page 3 of the thread about the owners son. It may help you understand what's changed. |
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Post by gashead79 on Jan 27, 2024 8:17:04 GMT
Shambolic owners. Building new stands, buying players, what will they think of next ? That stuff helps to generate revenue from gullible fans and sponsors. It's pretty clear that these guys have rotated in without any idea of how to run an English football club. It's like giving a jigsaw puzzle to a 3 year old..they might work it out in the end.. This situation is nothing more than helping mates, real estate, visas, and ego. Hopefully amongst all this, us losers might see our club be competitive and win a few matches for good value. We aren't unique either. Look at the state of the national game at club level. Yes, revenue is up, tickets for the top teams are scarce, but the money involved is all overseas from players right through to corporate sponsorship and investment. Its ruined. |
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