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Post by knowall on Nov 17, 2017 13:25:52 GMT
titivation - shame you don't understand English - look around the west stand hospitality, East stand, entrance gates, police accommodation, food sales points etc Football better - we were in the conference - was it really better then? - not sure you know what football is! You're not much of a "knowall" if you thought we were in the Conference when the new owners bought us? The quality of the players/football is only marginally better plus we've lost a lot of experienced players, Mildy, McM, Manse, Easter and Taylor and replaced them with the likes of the inexperienced Parts, Broadbent, Nicholls & Rolllin. Unless you are a family member I don't get your continued support of the ALQ's as it seems clear as day now there are big concerns where we are now heading under their ownership. Try reading with your new glasses - the sentence was 'Oh and the football was already better under DC before Wael and co arrived' - we were in the conference BEFORE Wael & Co arrived - and forgive me but I think the football was dire then. And if you think things were better under Higgs Ware and Twatola then I can recommend a good sanitorium
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Post by knowall on Nov 17, 2017 13:10:01 GMT
Even if that all happened we'd still be better off than with those 3 in charge of the club. If they can revive the UWE stadium project then at least we might a future if the ALQ's now have no interest in investing anymore money. And the benefit of reviving a bad deal at UWE is? eventual failure and the end of Bristol Rovers - they almost achieved that two years ago and you want them back? The basis for saying the Al-Qadi's have no interest in investing more money is? - rumour and innuendo by failed ex-directors!
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Post by knowall on Nov 17, 2017 12:52:56 GMT
I don't see the City fans (is Henbury really a Rovers fan?) complaining about the same wording in their accounts or in 90% of other Football League Club's accounts? Henbury is deffo a Rovers fan. I've met him at FFSC get togethers. I can't believe the number of people who are treating this as serious thread and taking the OP seriously. Just goes to show how ready many are to believe any old negative sh**e that's posted on here and what a good job the people who are spreading negative stories about the AQs are doing. Surprised you fell for it though. Good thread Henbury. Here endeth the lesson. Disagree - posts like this perpetuate distrust in our owners - too many readers of forums do not understand accounts and take words like Henbury's as honest and true.
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Post by knowall on Nov 17, 2017 12:48:05 GMT
I agree. But as I've said before. I've seen: - fees paid for players. - training ground plans. - stadium plans. - stadium titivation - better football - contactless payments - employment of key staff to take the club forward. - turn down fees - comments from DC directly saying the board are improving things. all small things but together add up to IMO stronger evidence than hearsay from unnamed sources that the Al-qadis are serious about this club. Not sure what titvation is, DC seems to be talking a different tune this week but stadium plans do please share these as you seem to be the only one that has seen these. Oh and the football was already better under DC before Wael and co arrived. NH was also happy to pay fees for players like Tom Parkes and not aware of which fees we have turned down for contracted players, can you share this with us? titivation - shame you don't understand English - look around the west stand hospitality, East stand, entrance gates, police accommodation, food sales points etc Football better - we were in the conference - was it really better then? - not sure you know what football is!
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Post by knowall on Nov 17, 2017 12:32:48 GMT
I don't see the City fans (is Henbury really a Rovers fan?) complaining about the same wording in their accounts or in 90% of other Football League Club's accounts?
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Post by knowall on Nov 17, 2017 12:28:40 GMT
Scare mongering nonsense. Should be banned for posting this sort of panic inducing propaganda. Totally agree - Henbury should know better -
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Post by knowall on Nov 16, 2017 20:01:29 GMT
The collapse of the UWE plan. Edit. And lack of fit for purpose nfrastructure UWE was f**ked beford the Al Qadis were here a d the infrastructure was sh** before they were here. And the ones who left the mess are the ones stirring now Ware, Higgs, Twatola
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Post by knowall on Nov 16, 2017 9:55:09 GMT
There is a phrase in football "never go back" and in the majority of cases this is good advice. Would I be happy with a return to the previous board ?.....absolutely not. They had their chance and successfully took the club into non league football ,made fools of themselves over the Sainsburys shananigans . Why don't they try Mangotsfield united or Bristol manor farm instead.
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Post by knowall on Nov 15, 2017 16:02:15 GMT
Summed up perfectly Stuart1974 - if the deal offered was any good - investors would have been knocking at the door - everybody is trying to find a good return on investments We have the same professional 'visionary' owners (as some would have us believe) - but the investors don't appear to be "knocking at the door" now for some reason. if the deal offered was any good
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Post by knowall on Nov 15, 2017 15:56:25 GMT
The level of rumour, passing remarks from those ITK and the silence from owners convince me that something is going on and the developments we were promised are not going to happen anythime soon as the current owners tigten the purse strings. I'm not sure what has happened in the last year but something definately seems to have changed in the mind-set of our owners. It's seems pretty clear that purse strings have tightened and we face a wall of silence that just causes speculatuion. What I don't understand is surely the Al Quadis knew the costs of running and developing a football club when they bought it, so what has changed? The only explanation I can see is that they thought UWE was a better deal than it proved to be. My guess is that now UWE is off the table to them the changes of operating at a sustantable level, which was there objective from day one, has now gone. I think they realise it will cost them a £1 million plus a year just to maintain the club even at it's present level. That is not a sustainable option for the family and hence I think the door must be at least ajar for a take-over. What has changed maybe the flexibility of UWE - according to reports the Al-Qadi family had hoped to include a hotel in their plans which for them would have made the deal more sustainable - the fear for Ware & Co (or any other body) would be if bankers don't like the sums is the project feasible? - and the fear for us supporters is we were on the edge of extinction two years ago - who is best placed to avoid that scenario in the future?
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Post by knowall on Nov 15, 2017 11:17:09 GMT
Your analogy doesn't provide any reassurance; it sounds just as bad to me! Possibly. Provided the driver is earning a good living and pays at least the minimum monthly repayment then the credit card company will be happy. They are getting their money at an acceptable rate and if the card starts to get close to the agreed limit then it is likely that the limit will be increased. In addition, other card companies will see that he is a good payer and want to offer him their cards too. Credit card companies don't like defaulters, but neither do they particularly like those who clear their cards each month. They get their money through people paying off some as they can then charge interest. Their ideal person is someone in a steady job who spends and then pays off gradually (but not wholly) while still spending. Turning back to us, if Swiss's interest theory is right, then Dwane will know many who would be interested in investing for a 6% return (as bankers they will have their clients and contacts). The difficulty is in the servicing of the interest and eventual capital repayment which for me us why the UWE fell through, the club/Dwane couldn't get UWE to agree commercial revenue terms (as Bidefordgas suggested in a previous post).That said, I am pretty poor at getting even football scores right so probably am here too. Summed up perfectly Stuart1974 - if the deal offered was any good - investors would have been knocking at the door - everybody is trying to find a good return on investments
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Post by knowall on Nov 15, 2017 11:06:44 GMT
As a way of me keeping sane in a mad world, I sometimes let my mind wonder about things and I have been musing over what various options we have. Purely my own thoughts but I tried to summarise the possibilities. The Mem Option 1 - do nothing. This would be the cheapest of the lot and many would be excused if they felt this was the only realistic choice. It would still require upkeep but the owners would likely lose the last vestiges of trust and ambition. Option 2 - one new build stand. My preferred choice in the short term if we are staying would be a new stand along the east side. It could hold c.6,000 seats and could even retain the existing terracing to increase ground capacity. If sited right it could allow a pitch resiting for future builds when money and needs demand. Cost would be around £10m I reckon and could be partly funded by grants. It would incorporate modest commercial facilities together with changing rooms, etc. As a statement of intent it would be acceptable and could allow us to have the odd cameo appearance in the Championship but nothing longer term. It could be built relatively quickly with minimal disruption and may receive planning without too much trouble. At least it would be a start. Option 3 - complete rebuild. This would be more of a statement of intent, if around 20,000 then it could permit in my view a sustained period of Championship football. It would be costly, lengthy to get planning permission for and disruptive. However nothing is impossible given time, money and effort so if Dwane are serious then it will happen. Would leave us sceptical in view of past attempts until the diggers move in, or even sometime afterwards too. UWE Option 4 - Dwane and the UWE resume talks and thrash out an agreement. It would return us to where we thought we were and as a new build it would definitely allow us to be competitative in the Championship. Officially ruled out so maybe a nonstarter. Option 5 - As option 4 but with new investors coming in to shore up Dwane's stake. Option 6 - New owners take over from where we were 20 months ago, q.v. other threads. Who knows? Groundhog day 😀 Alternative sites Option 7 - Back to square one again for the umpteenth time. In terms of alternatives, places that come to mind are Mangotsfield, Keynsham, Avonmouth, Lyde Green, Filton Airfield and the planned arena site near Temple Meads. Not sure if any of these are viable and I suspect that housing would take priority anyway. Any other options? When Roy Redman was a director he approached Aerospace about possible Brabazon hanger to become football stadium - possible now?
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Post by knowall on Nov 15, 2017 10:57:16 GMT
As long as they can deliver a new stadium and develop the club, i see no problem, if they come in and plan to do nothing then i would say no thanks. Trying to figure out how they developed the Club previously? Can anyone offer up their achievements?
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Post by knowall on Nov 13, 2017 16:21:43 GMT
Can anybody with financial know how explain the owners loan against the mem and paying themselves interest from it in a positive way? What happens when the £10m runs out and were still losing money? Why is dwayne sports making money from interest on the loan against the stadium? I may not be best placed and someone like Swiss may explain it better, but my understanding is that the loan shouldn't be thought of as a loan in the generic sense. What we have is a rolling credit facility which is perhaps better understood as a glorified credit card. BRFC is free to spend up to the agreed limit of £10m. When that £10m limit is reached something will need to be arranged, that could be Dwane writing off some or all of the debt, converting to shares (capitalising), increasing the limit or calling it in. In the last accounts, Hani confirmed that he will fund the club until at least March 2018 (12 months after the signing of the accounts). Okay, for the positive spin.... The charge is a fixed (rather than a floating) charge and is specifically for the £10m rolling credit facility (as per the Charge paperwork, see Companies House). Hani agreement for 12 months is a standard text for signing off accounts, nothing to be alarmed about here. The interest rate (be it Swiss's calculations or another figure) is an acceptable rate to entice investors who would otherwise be not interested and was deemed affordable at the time. It is the timing of the charge which I find interesting, being over a year since the takeover. It could be a purely administrative issue, it could be because the limit is being reached and Dwane wanted some security before agreeing to increase it again or it could be because a third party was hovering into view. As with much about the financial side, what you read into the various possibilities may be slightly skewed by what you (subconsciously) expect to see. All options as far as I can tell can be seen as positive ranging through benign accounting practices to the very disturbing. Even when the accounts become available next March it will only be up to June 2017 so will already be out of date. With all the uncertainty I would appreciate someone from the club to explain.But any relevant information which has occurred since June 2017 will have to be disclosed at the AGM so you will know.
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Post by knowall on Nov 12, 2017 20:42:04 GMT
Unfortunately Swizzgas you make too many assumptions - NH & BB's family were owed (according to last accounts) £1.3m - now cleared? - ask them! Loans of £11m - an estimate (guess) which you cannot substantiate Annual interest now of £650 000 - based on a figure which you cannot substantiate - nor the rate. Annual interest in the future of £1m - pure speculation - Whilst the likes of Ware, Higgs, Twatola and BSS may appear to be suggesting they have alternative ways of bringing what we would all like - some would say they failed miserably before so what is different now? We are on the same side “knowall” and, with respect, you and others are making the assumption that anyone questioning the owners must be part of that infamous “hidden agenda” but I can assure you my thoughts are entirely my own. I’ve substantiated how I arrived at loan amounts and interest rates many times and don’t intend going over it again because it’s all in the 2016 accounts. And, as I said in the post above, if the trend from 2016 continues Rovers will owe Dwane Sports £15 million in three years time and be paying them £1 million per annum interest. In the last year the owners have responded quickly to rumours of them wanting to sell the club and of the impending collapse of the UWE Stadium deal but they have remained ominously silent on the question of loan interest. Until the 2017 accounts are finalised they have an opportunity to change their policy of charging interest on their loan and if they did that it would go a long way towards restoring fans’ confidence. Ed Ware, Nick Higgs, Toni Watola and Brian Seymour-Smith are all Rovers supporters who tried to bring success to the club. The fact they failed is no cause for gloating and, as one of their fiercest critics, I would say that if they are now suggesting alternative avenues to explore then it is at least worth listening. Acceptance of the problem is the first step towards a solution. Last week I posted the link to a statement from Hearts FC to show that excellent communication isn’t difficult to achieve but when you see it you realize what we have been missing at Rovers for so long. And if you delve further into the way Hearts financed their new grandstand you can see what is possible when there is transparency and when everyone pulls together. www.heartsfc.co.uk/news/6106We are only on the same side Swissgas if you quote and accept facts. I do not accept your version of loan amounts and interest rates which are not in the accounts as you claim or even what you call 'the trend' which is pure speculation or guesswork. Regarding previous Directors I do not gloat, quite the opposite, they did their best but were taken for a ride, and stayed on the bus long after they should have recognised it was the wrong bus (and which consequently added considerably to the current debt) I feel sorry for them as they believed like many did that Sainsburys were honourable. Why should anyone believe that they have the answers now - especially as there were other offers before which they turned down for their own benefit? As for the current owners - they have things to prove - but I do not recall promises being made that have yet to be realised.
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Post by knowall on Nov 12, 2017 15:53:53 GMT
So other than the running cost debts..which occur whoever is in charge. The Al Qadi family have exchanged the previous owners loans with their own loans. So BRFC owe the Al Qadis £3.5million now rather than the previous directors. The Wonga loan at high interests is replaced by a loan from the Al Qadis.
So currently nothing is worse than before. It could be viewed that the plan of championship football in a few years time or a new stadium could have seen money wiping out that debt over a short time. So it is a case of getting extra income streams into the club as quickly as possible so the reliance on loans or gifts is ended.
If the trend from the 2016 accounts is continued, and Nick Higgs and Barry Bradshaw are still owed nearly £1 million between them as they were then, the position would be : Pre acquisition. Loans of about £7 million with annual interest of £420 000 Post acquisition. Loans of about £11 million with annual interest of about £ 650 000 I would suggest that things are considerably worse than before. Even if we are super optimistic and say that substantial new revenue streams will appear in 3 years time it is likely Rovers would be £15 million in debt and running up £1 million per year interest bills by then. Unfortunately Swizzgas you make too many assumptions - NH & BB's family were owed (according to last accounts) £1.3m - now cleared? - ask them! Loans of £11m - an estimate (guess) which you cannot substantiate Annual interest now of £650 000 - based on a figure which you cannot substantiate - nor the rate. Annual interest in the future of £1m - pure speculation - Whilst the likes of Ware, Higgs, Twatola and BSS may appear to be suggesting they have alternative ways of bringing what we would all like - some would say they failed miserably before so what is different now?
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Post by knowall on Nov 12, 2017 15:04:08 GMT
Are we just going to start ripping the team apart one by one ? We all can see that confidence is low at this time so what we need to do is stick two fingers up to everyone else and do what we used to do in times of trouble and get behind the team that unites us all ! We are the GAS don't ever forget it ! We were better off when we dreamt that one day we would win the equivalent of the football lottery ( rich owners ) We never will so let's go back to getting behind the team we all love UTG Wouldn't it be nice - unfortunately we have too many who are like the so-called supporters south of the river - too eager to have a go at any player - even our own.
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Post by knowall on Nov 11, 2017 16:04:03 GMT
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Post by knowall on Nov 11, 2017 15:36:58 GMT
Referee Stockbridge is a regular at Scunthorpe - usually twice a season there and local away matches too
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Post by knowall on Nov 10, 2017 11:03:20 GMT
In order to build a stadium, capital is required.(£40m?) Certainly more than E Ware has. So who will provide the capital for say two years whilst stadium is built and what return would the lender require? Nothing? do not believe that. So that is the first profit take out. And who will actually own it? and what rights of income would they require? second profit take-out opportunity. And in order to move into the turn-key stadium, DSports would GIVE away The Mem? (£20m) third profit take-out opportunity. And are we saying in return for fronting £40m stadium build EW builders would have £20m Mem which would have to be knocked down in order to build houses and make a profit - rather expensive houses for Horfield area?
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